OK, bring in the DB Techies

General 'Hibernian' forum for the entire cluster
Nejtun
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Post by Nejtun »

Vampiiress wrote:I've lost everything on 3 main chars, and on 3 less important chars. We talk about artifacts, ml10 stuff and crafted mp's. There is no way I can remember each item. This is not all !

At one of my accounts, I cant log onto Rightnow, as it Say my user ID is invalid. I logged into my subscription page, and everything is as it should be. Both my user ID and My e-mail adress is correct, but still I cant log onto right now, and not even request new password, as it wont reconize my user ID. Other ppl I've talked to have other strange things happening when contacting Rightnow - such as recieving an email on their emailadress, but adressing someone else.
two things to make sure when you are doing more than one right now account , first ( and this applies to even single ones ) right now uses your game login for access and not your subscription login ,

second , ( this may not applpy depending on your internet settings ) you may stay logged into right now even if you close all the windows on your browser , you can log out by clicking the " this isnt me " link at the top of the bit after you click the flag of your country , more often than not though it is the first thing , with the wrong type of details entered :)
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Ovi
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Post by Ovi »

Ankh Morpork wrote:Don't forget that GOA apparently can't say due to some restrictions in their contract with Mythic. (or so they say atleast)

/Ankh
Would be interesting, for once, to see a joint statement by Goa & Mythic on the problems. I know it will be SoB, but at least we won't have each side blaming the other if they make it a joint statement.

Ankh Morpork

Post by Ankh Morpork »

Now that would be interesting for sure!

/Ankh

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Cromcruaich
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Post by Cromcruaich »

Its totally beyond me how come mythic are using a relational database (MySQL), yet the explanation by requiel that items have been purged is the key field representing an object (the name by the looks of it!) has been corrupted.

The explanations given so far just go against everything that people who know databases know to be best practice.

It seems absurd that they have been unable to run a cross database query (between what was the current live one we see now and the last good backup) essentially saying insert all items that exist in the old db that dont exist in the current db where we detect item corruption on a per char basis.

Perhaps this is because it is a database operation for which they have to pay mythic for the time, as opposed to this restore for which they use there own people who they are currently paying anyway.
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Cernos
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Post by Cernos »

Finolin wrote:Bad analogy - you've leased a car and you get it serviced by the company from whom you are leasing it. Then it stops working one day, so the company takes it in to service it. You get it back a week later but it has a funny noise in the engine. The company says they can't do anything about it. If you don't know anything about cars, you'll be annoyed but happy to have the car back. But if you're a mechanic, you'll be curious what the company did to fix it, and especially why there's still the funny noise, as maybe you've fixed cars before and managed to do so without the noise.
Or more like, you get the car back, it's working again but all the doors, seats and interior fittings are missing. Does a bare chassis + engine constitute a viable car?

Killder
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Post by Killder »

Cromcruaich wrote:It seems absurd that they have been unable to run a cross database query (between what was the current live one we see now and the last good backup) essentially saying insert all items that exist in the old db that dont exist in the current db where we detect item corruption on a per char basis.
EXACTLY !!!

There are numerous ways to mass-update a database. If GOA claim to be able to spot people trying to scam free items in their RightNow email it's obvious they have access to 2 sets of data - uncorrupted pre-rollback data and possibly-corrupted post rollback data. Any DBA worth his salt should have numerous possible options to automate the corrections rather than via emails from people who may not know everything they have lost.

Xest
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Post by Xest »

Killder wrote:EXACTLY !!!

There are numerous ways to mass-update a database. If GOA claim to be able to spot people trying to scam free items in their RightNow email it's obvious they have access to 2 sets of data - uncorrupted pre-rollback data and possibly-corrupted post rollback data. Any DBA worth his salt should have numerous possible options to automate the corrections rather than via emails from people who may not know everything they have lost.
Careful, this is pretty much what I've been saying for the last few days and I got mobbed over it :p
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Trez
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Post by Trez »

All I know is, that if GOA cant restore all the items I lost on my 6 chars they can go F... themselves.

I cant get myself to spend all the time I used getting items for my chars only to have GOA crap it up because they cant take a normal backup like all other companies do.
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Requiel
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Post by Requiel »

I answered some of these queries in this post.
To expand a little more, when we check your claim we aren't checking a backup of your character. If we had a good backup then we wouldn't need to be doing this at all and I wouldn't be racking up the overtime. What we are doing is pulling your character's trade logs and running searches in our parser. So for example you say you're missing Love Story 3/3 on the character Bobkeen. We pull Bobkeen's trade logs and search for all instances of Love Story 3/3, if the number you've picked up/bought/been traded is one greater than the number you've handed off then we owe you a Love Story 3/3. Yes it really is as crude as that.

As to how the database works or why the backups we have are no good, then I'm afraid I can't answer that as I'm not technical enough to understand the details or comment on the various theories put forwards here and the larger part of the work was done by Mythic devs rather than our own technical teams. Also I suspect that even if I did know, I wouldn't be allowed to tell you. I can however say that one of the suggestions put forwards is largely true. There was a major change made to nearly all the databases in the game in preparation for clustering. A lot of new fields were added and the way in which certain databases inter-related changed. Again I can't give you anything more concrete than that but it certainly did contribute to the problem even if it wasn't the root cause.

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Lieva
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Post by Lieva »

req

one thing i would like to ask

why were we told a small number of us would suffer

almost 2/3 of freddys house have suffored with this and i know 2 of my personal chars have lost items (minor - arurualite stuff not gonna bother reporting)

is the problem worse than was expected or just we all been very unlucky and the majority of active accounts rather than expired ones were corrupted?
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