Xest wrote:I'm sure you're just being ignorant to save face and avoid admitting the obvious parallels between my example of mathematics and languages. The way we use maths, the notations and symbols we use could all have been different had they not been so widespread by Alexander's empire, we could've been working with a base 5 number system here in England, we may have used a different symbol to denote pi and so on. This is exactly the same as countries ending up using the English language due to the British empire when they could likewise have been using something else.
Of course not everything in mathematics today extends from the Greeks/Arabs, but that's where it has its roots, likewise with the English language it has changed through the years but the roots of it's spread were with the British empire.
You're almost making it sound as if you beleive the English language was the only thing spread by questionable methods when you persistently ignore the fact that many things were spread this way and that English is absolutely no way unique in that.
Xest,
your the one avoiding making direct responses I am not so sure if your being ignorant though. I do think your deliberately avoiding the argument.
The argument you are constructing is an analogy in order for it to work the analogy has to be directly comparable. It is a weak form of arguement because invariably analogies are not similar enough for them to be workable.
I thought it was pretty obvious that in fact your anology between the English language and mathematics it is not drectly comparable. Your argument is that other ideas i.e. mathematics have been spread by imperialism and they have not been shameful and that if I feel shame in relation to English why don't I feel shame in relation to all these other things.
I defined shame for you as being directly related to how one sees
ones self in the face of the world. You have side stepped that and tried to pursue a logical point that you are now trying to remove from its context in the argument. Mathematics does not compare on the basic attribute of my argument because mathematics is not something I see as specifically integral to my self identity as a British citizen. I cannot see any shame in mathematics in other words.
English is however profoundly related to my Britishness and like I have stated over and over I feel there is a culture of shame associated with how we behaved in the past. Now you might argue that this is irrational, and not very useful. I agree but it exists nontheless. Others who have stopped posting here expressed the same sensitivity. It is clear from your posts and Ovi's that not everyone feels that shame. Well do as you choose. Personally I perfer to feel the shame I feel it makes me more sensitive. I see Gwen and others also value some sensitivity to others although they might express it differently.
I stated earlier in the thread that it is somewhat ironic that the non-native English speakers find our argument here strange. They are non British and therefore cannot feel that sensitivity I referred to. Likewise they would agree most likely with you and I that mathematics is not offensive in its current form.
So basically your analogy fails to relate to the basic crux of my argument. Now tell me am I being ignorant?
Sharkith
