Deleted Thread on FH - read here (concerns Synergy)

[<ankh>]

I even warned Thand in the past, and Ankh for that matter. So it shouldnt really matter imo.

But I didnt listen and I still don't ]/Ankh[/B]

[Lairiodd]

Ofcourse i ditched your idea, as making the whole part of fg instances only etc would take out a great part of the surprice element the game currently have, you tried wow BGs? Horrible, just insanely horrible pvp that and in so many ways it dont have the amount of possibilities as daoc have.

A possible rule would be that groups can be locked. You can set a flag that you want to play fg vs fg only. If any member of your group is attacked by another group with this flag set, then both groups are locked. Groups that are already in combat with a group without the flag set cannot be locked. When locked, neither group can be attacked or aided by chars outside the group. This would apply to heals/buffs/rezzes and croc tear ring like effects as well as debuffing / DDing the enemy group. (Hmm, this would mean that buffbots wouldn't be allowed as they are out of group ... so maybe an exception ?).

A "call for help" option could also apply. If any member of either group calls for help, then the two groups become unlocked. In FFXI, there is this rule in pve, when your group attacks a mob, nobody else can attack it. If you call for help, the mob becomes worth no exp (they should add a rule that if nobody actually helps you in the end, it still is worth exp ... but erm, I am getting off topic).

The lock would drop when the two groups count as being out of combat with each other for 30 seconds. This would allow a stealther from one group to run away and the groups to become disengaged. The lock drop instantly when the living members of both groups are more than say 3000 away from each other or when one group is all dead.

Back in the good old days when this topic was being discussed (shockingly this is not a new topic ), it was pointed out that "zerging" was a way for people with less experience/realm skills to balance the odds. A guild group of high rr players is likely a match for more than 1 fg of lower experienced plays.

In the lock code above, would people think a rule that a battlegroup which have a total realm rank of 40 or less should be allowed to count as a single group . This would be 2 groups of average realm rank of 2L5 or 3 groups with an average realm rank of 1L6. A full group where everyone has realm level of 5+ would be limited to 1fg.

This could possibly be exploited. All npcs would have to ignore the locks and also probably locks should drop in the vicinity of keeps etc.

[Satyn]

I'm neither for, nor against adding, but there is nothing "fair" about RvR anyway. The only "fair" thing about RvR is that you can do unto others as they do to you (and vice versa).

Never thought i would ever agree with you Gandy but now I do.

But I didnt listen and I still don't ]/Ankh[/B]

doesnt make me stop trying tho

[<ankh>]

what ever norcott is typing atm just ignore him

/Ankh

[Norcott]

This has turned into a nice thread to read.

And tbh, I didnt even know till i read this thread that Agramon was a no adding area. So why think that everyone knows or should know that?

Technically it isnt.. its again.. players expected rule.. (which if anything now leaves it wide open for lets say the odd Ranger/Hunter/Scout to go have a look around now knowing its a Player expected rule and not a game rule...)
just to prove the point otherwise ofc if it was to take there fancy one boring evening..
i could see this to be very vindictive from the stealther community especially if there having a bad week getting rolled by grps.
This discussion could just go around and around.. grps roll stealthers or soloers.. stealther/soloers go nasty and return the compliment byt picking off key classes in a 8v8 situation.. its Ni on impossible to get a common ground because there will always be the minority who will do it on purpose because they can.. and lets face doesnt take many to spoil a grp v grp fight in a zone if they so wish..


ps .. yea yea Ankh..

[Satyn]

I know that technically it isnt ... i was just referring to the fact that some players made Agrammon a non adding zone. And that they cant expect everyone to know that. Or to even respect that.

[Hrymf]

A possible rule would be that groups can be locked. You can set a flag that you want to play fg vs fg only. If any member of your group is attacked by another group with this flag set, then both groups are locked. Groups that are already in combat with a group without the flag set cannot be locked. When locked, neither group can be attacked or aided by chars outside the group. This would apply to heals/buffs/rezzes and croc tear ring like effects as well as debuffing / DDing the enemy group. (Hmm, this would mean that buffbots wouldn't be allowed as they are out of group ... so maybe an exception ?).

A "call for help" option could also apply. If any member of either group calls for help, then the two groups become unlocked. In FFXI, there is this rule in pve, when your group attacks a mob, nobody else can attack it. If you call for help, the mob becomes worth no exp (they should add a rule that if nobody actually helps you in the end, it still is worth exp ... but erm, I am getting off topic).

The lock would drop when the two groups count as being out of combat with each other for 30 seconds. This would allow a stealther from one group to run away and the groups to become disengaged. The lock drop instantly when the living members of both groups are more than say 3000 away from each other or when one group is all dead.

Back in the good old days when this topic was being discussed (shockingly this is not a new topic ), it was pointed out that "zerging" was a way for people with less experience/realm skills to balance the odds. A guild group of high rr players is likely a match for more than 1 fg of lower experienced plays.

In the lock code above, would people think a rule that a battlegroup which have a total realm rank of 40 or less should be allowed to count as a single group . This would be 2 groups of average realm rank of 2L5 or 3 groups with an average realm rank of 1L6. A full group where everyone has realm level of 5+ would be limited to 1fg.

This could possibly be exploited. All npcs would have to ignore the locks and also probably locks should drop in the vicinity of keeps etc.

The ideas seem fair, but it might be very hard to code these "locks" into the game, which is also our current problem.. The game is not currently made only for fg vs fg or the like, its made for all forms of rvr and the best way we can sort it is by doing it inbetween us, on forums and the like.

Aran: If someone quits a game because of a word or two spoken in a game and they are seriously offended, its obvious that this game is not for them. Infact RL is not for them then, since you can read and see alot of things that may seem offending, its really up to your self to be mature enough to view a bit less negative on text's.


Belisar seems to have found a great way to balance the playstyles so there is room for both, and im sure noone would have any problems with that sort of behaviour, though as he say there can always occure misunderstandings and small unlucky situations

As for the adding comments in fights, i must admitt i have now and then yelled semi rude comments towards groups who add on a fight i have, and obviously this is a very wrong way to deal with it. Often you can get by with talking nicely to the adders and try explain them that you like to keep the fight in a certain way, sometimes they understand and others they dont.

Think main problem with us fg players is as i said earlier, we are a bit competive and see the rvr as a form of sport. So just like you will get exsited in a soccer match and yell when there is goal or yell when the referee suck I get exsited by having a nice fight and then when another grp adds in it really destroys the moment. I know its hard for some to understand, but im sure im not alone on seeing this game as a sport more than just relaxing fun

[Kallima]

This goes for everything then, and seriously, anyone who feel offended by a single word like that should stay inside a dark room all alone rest of his/her life, because im pretty sure where ever you go you will find something that in any way could be more rude and more horrible than a word like adder... Its really up to the person them self to not start crying just because someone say a word, and like i said earlier its simple a discribtion of an action ingame.

Bear in mind, because people seem to forget this, that this is a game. Its not a job, where you have to put up with aggro. Its not something you must do to survive. Its for fun, its an escape. You can do a lot of other things with your time.

If someone in this game appears to be hassling you, you don't need to be wildly upset or offended to decide you'll do something else for a bit rather than put up with idiots. If you are addicted then you may stay regardless of insults or whatever. If you aren't then there are other things you may prefer to do. So, if someone says things that can be read as insulting and out to hassle me, and doesn't quit after a slap or a polite request, I may not bother to debate their motives with them, I may decide this is a good time to sleep, eat, have fun doing something else, and log.

[Hrymf]

I'm neither for, nor against adding, but there is nothing "fair" about RvR anyway. The only "fair" thing about RvR is that you can do unto others as they do to you (and vice versa).

Very wrong that, thats called revenge. And surely just because one person do wrong dont mean you can do the same?

Just because someone scam ingame, dont mean its okay for you to scam also, does it?

Just because someone play retarded in your opinion, it dont really help to play the same way, does it?

And to make a bit silly RL example, just because someone kill your bro, dont mean you can kill that persons bro, does it?

[Hrymf]

Bear in mind, because people seem to forget this, that this is a game. Its not a job, where you have to put up with aggro. Its not something you must do to survive. Its for fun, its an escape. You can do a lot of other things with your time.

If someone in this game appears to be hassling you, you don't need to be wildly upset or offended to decide you'll do something else for a bit rather than put up with idiots. If you are addicted then you may stay regardless of insults or whatever. If you aren't then there are other things you may prefer to do. So, if someone says things that can be read as insulting and out to hassle me, and doesn't quit after a slap or a polite request, I may not bother to debate their motives with them, I may decide this is a good time to sleep, eat, have fun doing something else, and log.

Theres a large difference from yelling adder at a person who adds, and to keep insulting and harrashing the person. You can ignore and even report people who do this to you, so thats not really an issue.