Dragon Respec stones, Goa's Responce

Post by **Lieva** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:20 pm

any chance of telling us which are guaranteed 100%

cause now we kinda cant believe the patch notes

Botond · Post by **Botond** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:25 pm

Quinlan wrote:It did deliver tbh Sharkith. Requiel has absolutely no reason to lie. What would he gain from lieing? Unless you have people who can actually check the table i guess he wont be believed. And dont get me started on the US CSR's. Now all of the sudden there sayings are holy but there are also numerous theads about how they spout bullshit.

I full heartedly agree that it sucks you didnt get the stones. Tough luck

How many times "Awarkle and they boys" did kill the dragon? How many times others had kill it?and ever met any1 be4 who said "lol,no stones!!"? So it's most likely 99,9999%chance to drop.

Now whats the point of makein somethin with that drop rate besides to make some player angry?

Brilliant,really brilliant,but nowdays they cant afford such selfentertainin jokes with this ammount of customer.

Imo.

Cryn · Post by **Cryn** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:31 pm

I think some mistake has been made somewhere. Either the patch notes are incorrect, or GOA's implementation of the game is incorrect.

However, this is not something people should be getting hostile towards GOA or Requiel about. Mistakes happen. They are not malicious and in this case the mistake didn't even cause any real problem since RA respecs are so common.

I've had to ask Requiel for help maybe 3 or 4 times since he's been GM and I can say that in every case he was pleasant and helpful, even in one situation where the problem was caused by a mistake of my own.

stupeh · Post by **stupeh** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:10 pm

Why does it have to be GoA's implementation of the game, if they aren't allowed to change it, then surely it's the code Mythic have done.

Cyfr · Post by **Cyfr** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 5:03 pm

This is like Judge Judy.

Dragon on Trial

Nilmeia · Post by **Nilmeia** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 5:05 pm

Cyfr wrote:This is like Judge Judy.

Dragon on Trial

Thats a beautiful horse

Jupi · Post by **Jupi** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 5:19 pm

Xest wrote:The problem is it's not really a definite answer as Requiel's claims contradict Mythic's and as Mythic are the developers who design and produce the game content itself then that's how it should be no matter what Requiel says and if it isn't working like that it should be treated as a bug and resolved. It doesn't matter what the code says if it contradicts the design documentation then it's the code that's wrong not the design docs. Documentation is there for a reason and any professional game designers will tell you it's the docs that need to be followed, sure you can change the docs but you have to fully research the effects and impacts of changing the docs - not just change it because one of the coders got something wrong.

I'm not saying Requiel is wrong about the chance to drop at code level, I am however saying he's wrong about not rewarding what should be a guaranteed drop according to official sources and the people who design and produce the game and I am saying he's not doing a great job of customer relations. I think it's great to have someone like Requiel there for the community (much like Sanya) but those people shouldn't be GMs and customer support too, eventually you can guarantee that it'll cause problems.

wow i find myself akin to xest's sentiments, bloody hell i feel faint

Post by **Xest** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 5:36 pm

Cryn wrote:I think some mistake has been made somewhere. Either the patch notes are incorrect, or GOA's implementation of the game is incorrect.

However, this is not something people should be getting hostile towards GOA or Requiel about. Mistakes happen. They are not malicious and in this case the mistake didn't even cause any real problem since RA respecs are so common.

I've had to ask Requiel for help maybe 3 or 4 times since he's been GM and I can say that in every case he was pleasant and helpful, even in one situation where the problem was caused by a mistake of my own.

I think it's the fact that Requiel refuses to grant something that's clearly intended to be a 100% guaranteed drop that's the problem. If it's meant to be guaranteed then it should be awarded, his excuses for not awarding it are extremely weak - as said already if the code doesn't follow the design docs the code is wrong and at fault and not the docs. As I also said if someone made a typo in the docs sure you can have a meeting or informal discussion to rectify the docs and ensure the change to the docs is what's accurate and intended but the code should never be changed until the docs are amended.

Tare GOA can change portions of the game, a massive amount of DAoC and just about every MMOGs code is seperated out to scripts, MMOGs require more content than most games so having a sensible level of seperation between code and content means a company can hire people to work on content without either needing to be coders or needing to interrupt the coding team so I assure there's a lot that GOA could change - and as past incidents have shown, there's a lot GOA can accidently change. Changing the design docs because of a code fault is a bad idea - as someone mentioned if PBAE was accidently set to too high damage and a lot of recoding was require to fix it do you honestly think the design docs should be changed to suit the code?

It's common good practice in game development to ensure seperation of code from content nowadays, it's also common good practice to follow design docs and if something isn't following the docs to rectify it. As I've said already the correct response from Requiel should've been to award the stones and to report the issue as a bug - when it's clear that the intention is that the stones should ALWAYS drop which clearly is the intention here the customer shouldn't be the one to have to suffer the penalties. It cannot be argued that the dragon isn't intended to drop the stones every single time - that that is intended is unquestionable due to the docs and the official CSR response. It could be argued that even though that is the intention that Requiel doesn't have to grant the stones but that is a weak argument because again, the customer should never be penalised for a game bug when the bug isn't so serious that it hurts the game. Those are the facts, period.

Botond · Post by **Botond** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 5:47 pm

Xest wrote:stuff

If some1 advertise a soap that it WILL clear my hand even if it dirty form oil all over and it doesnt,i go to the shop and get my money back,cause they lied,no matter if its the soap's or the water i use the faulty.They said if i manage to kill the dragon i get 50 stones,25 full and 25 RA respec.It turned out they lied,i want my money back.

Send me back 3 years subscription GoA,and its gonna be ok.

OohhoO · Post by **OohhoO** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 5:56 pm

just to add to the above ...

even if after GOAs reporting the issue to Mythic as a bug if Mythic decided that all was working as intended & the documentation should be changed & not the code, the players should still get the stones as the official documentation at the time of the raid quite clearly stated that the stones are a guaranteed drop.

This has absolutely nothing to do with anyones personal integrity IMO. It's about the official documentation, the expectations which said documentation raise, & plain & simple customer service.