Dragon Respec stones, Goa's Responce

Luz · Post by **Luz** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 12:24 pm

ok so theres no 100% drops at all in this game thats nice......

Tindragon · Post by **Tindragon** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 12:30 pm

What about arti's which atm everybody consider "sure drops" ??
Those aren't so sure after all or what ??

- Tindragon | Golden Age

nibs · Post by **nibs** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 1:02 pm

GOA have advertised the dragon will drop the stones (in patch notes published on their own website). This isn't a maybe, this isn't a 99.999% chance, this is a definitive statement - this is a statement where no amount of claims can change what it actually says. The patch notes aren't misleading, they are clear in their meaning. GOA's own webpage states the dragon will drop it; and the dragon was killed and it wasn't dropped. As advertised; they should be entitle to the stones.

However to be honest - it's an absolute joke that Requiel is attempting to throw drop rates and statistics at us. What his saying is true im sure. But ill go out on a limb and assume that GOA are obligated by contract to deliver the game without interference to the code regarding the game dynamics - yes they can fix encounters and so on; but they dont have the right to modify any actual game code to differentiate the product from that leased from the game owners. This would mean that whatever the game dynamics are depicted as in the patch notes should be delivered without question; and to this extent by contract GOA are obligated to see to it that this occurs.

As clearly stated in the patch notes; a definitive and concludable answer on the drop rate on the stones from the dragon can not logically be argued with non published statistics.

I accept that statistics Requeil is putting forth. But official documentation depicts a publicly viewable statement which differs to what you say. It isn't right to advertise one thing and offer another. And i do believe that you should just give the 25 RA stones to the raid leader in order to honour your documentation.

Penlid · Post by **Penlid** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 1:15 pm

With evidence from Mythic saying they are a pure 100% drop, there is definitely something wrong with your loot tables etc etc. Mythic make the game, you get it in 1 way and another add bugs to it, translate it into arabic by mistake and try to work out how to translate it back.

At the end of the day you get the patch from Mythic, translate it then put it on your servers. So whatever a mythic CSR says is the truth. GoA don't hold the rights to change anything in game, so the respec stones should always drop with evidence from Xest's photo and my knowledge.

kash · Post by **kash** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 1:21 pm

Tindragon wrote:What about arti's which atm everybody consider "sure drops" ??
Those aren't so sure after all or what ??

- Tindragon | Golden Age

Well ive heard the same happening to GoV, most people swears its 100% drop i but i heard of it not dropping twice, i guess when its 99% its gona drop so often people think it is 100%

Reza · Post by **Reza** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 1:43 pm

lol at the whine/hostility in this thread.

Couple of interesting question for Requiel:

1) Is it possible you can tell us what the exact % chance is for the stones to drop? If for no other reason than to work out exactly how unlucky this raid was

(sounds like 1/1000 or 1/10000 chance)

2) Is it possible that since the codeing wont allow for any drop from the loot table to be a 100% guarantee that those that are set at over 99% are for all intents and purposes meant to actually be guaranteed drops, and that this together with the woolly patch notes suggesting that they are guaranteed drops is why allegedly similar rare occurances in the US lead to CSRs arranging for the items to be given?

Tare · Post by **Tare** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 2:25 pm

Requiel wrote:Drops and how they work:
T The first and most common way is from a drop table. These are the drops that appear in green letters when a mob is killed. Every single drop that drops that way is subject to a random chance that is less than 100%. There are no exceptions. The chance can be very, very high indeed (greater than 99%) but it cannot be 100% if it drops in this way.

Here's the answer, close the thread.

RA respec stones are not a guaranteed drop.
skill respec stones are not a guaranteed drop.
Artifacts are not a guaranteed drop.

By design, no item is a guaranteed drop, except for questbased items. If a patchnote states otherwise, the patchnotes are wrong. Although players should have been informed, this is how it is. Just bad luck this time. Thank you Requiel

Post by **Xest** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 2:31 pm

Tare wrote:Here's the answer, close the thread.

RA respec stones are not a guaranteed drop.
skill respec stones are not a guaranteed drop.
Artifacts are not a guaranteed drop.

By design, no item is a guaranteed drop, except for questbased items. If a patchnote states otherwise, the patchnotes are wrong. Although players should have been informed, this is how it is. Just bad luck this time. Thank you Requiel

The problem is it's not really a definite answer as Requiel's claims contradict Mythic's and as Mythic are the developers who design and produce the game content itself then that's how it should be no matter what Requiel says and if it isn't working like that it should be treated as a bug and resolved. It doesn't matter what the code says if it contradicts the design documentation then it's the code that's wrong not the design docs. Documentation is there for a reason and any professional game designers will tell you it's the docs that need to be followed, sure you can change the docs but you have to fully research the effects and impacts of changing the docs - not just change it because one of the coders got something wrong.

I'm not saying Requiel is wrong about the chance to drop at code level, I am however saying he's wrong about not rewarding what should be a guaranteed drop according to official sources and the people who design and produce the game and I am saying he's not doing a great job of customer relations. I think it's great to have someone like Requiel there for the community (much like Sanya) but those people shouldn't be GMs and customer support too, eventually you can guarantee that it'll cause problems.

Tare · Post by **Tare** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 2:35 pm

Fact: No item is a guaranteed drop.
Fact: the patch notes say in the case of dragon stones, they are.

Wouldn't it be easier to just change patch notes to "very high chance of dropping" instead of changing the entire code of a game, which GoA can't do anyway?

Requiel · Post by **Requiel** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 2:43 pm

There are guaranteed drop items, but nothing that drops in green letters is one of them. I used quest items as an example but some other loot can drop as a result of monster AI scripts. Most artifacts for example drop that way and some are a 100% drop.