Raid leaders claiming loot discussion -- split from Rowennas Ml rush

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Lieva
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Post by Lieva »

Armok wrote:bah why did a mod cut my post from main one and remake it as a new topic? looks like im inciting a flame war on pre claimers

but i would like to point out i did NOT ask a mod to cut my original question from the ml thread and make a new flamebait post here .. cos i only asked if pre-claiming was ok as a general question . not a flame on his/her intentions on the raid :)
there was a complaint made regarding the posts being previously deleted so the thread was split and put here insted.
unintentional that yours is the first ;)
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Post by Cryn »

Jarahl wrote:All those points are only if the Raid didnt get as many sign ups as needed, so you actually need skill to make the raid work. Lets face it, most have done ML1-10 on at least 1 char now, many even more, so more or less everyone know what to do now, so its not like you need much more than /faceloc xxxxx yyyyy, say /bu Zerg and moving to next target.

Leading raids is piss easy when more than 50 people comes, if you ask me!

Many people comes on raids for a shot of a rare drop.

I still find pre-claiming is teh suck, and will never ever pre-claim myself.
If you get large number of people the problems don't go away, they just become different problem.

One of the worst things that can happen from a raid leader's point of view is if people LD at critical times. This is much more likely to happen with a big zerg, and you end up having to try to convince people to retry certain steps, etc. Now that's stress.

Also, with a larger group it's intrinsically more work to manage it. You got more people not paying attention (eg. talking to an npc before they are told or attacking something they shouldn't), more work to organise groups and speed, etc and more people to beg you for favours or quibble about tactics in /bc.

On top of that you've got steps like ML2.10 which are actually harder with a zerg.
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Post by Jarahl »

Cryn wrote:If you get large number of people the problems don't go away, they just become different problem.

One of the worst things that can happen from a raid leader's point of view is if people LD at critical times. This is much more likely to happen with a big zerg, and you end up having to try to convince people to retry certain steps, etc. Now that's stress.

Also, with a larger group it's intrinsically more work to manage it. You got more people not paying attention (eg. talking to an npc before they are told or attacking something they shouldn't), more work to organise groups and speed, etc and more people to beg you for favours or quibble about tactics in /bc.

On top of that you've got steps like ML2.10 which are actually harder with a zerg.

If people go LD while a step mob is at 2%, tough luck, happend to me loads of times.

Besides 2.10 is piss easy, get mob to 2%, have people zerg in, all get credit and is happy.

Seriously cant believe people think im some noob who never lead an ML raid, because I have and I think they are easy :) Wont repeat this now anymore, and tbh I think I wont post anymore in this thread unless people quote me :)
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Post by Sharkith »

Haven't read all the posts but raid leaders deserve to be able to preclaim. I have no complaints if they do and I would just ask that they be as clear as possible up front and that they do not change their rules in the middle of a series of raids. That is where the confusion and complaining starts. Basically if you run raids you deserve something and I for one would not complain.

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Post by Sugah »

My view on this is :) Preclaiming items isn't a bad thing as long as its kept within reason. I'll be running a ML raid a week from next sunday and i've only said i'll claim one item from the entire 1-10 raid. On the flip side if preclaiming gets more people leading raids then its got to be a good thing and finally if you don't like the rules don't attend the raids.
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Post by Cryn »

Jarahl wrote:If people go LD while a step mob is at 2%, tough luck, happend to me loads of times.

Besides 2.10 is piss easy, get mob to 2%, have people zerg in, all get credit and is happy.

Seriously cant believe people think im some noob who never lead an ML raid, because I have and I think they are easy :) Wont repeat this now anymore, and tbh I think I wont post anymore in this thread unless people quote me :)
I never made any comment about whether you led raids or not. Leading raids doesn't make you (or me) the be all and end all expert on raid leading. My opinion is that there is some work involved that is deserves recognition. Your opinion, from what I can tell, is that leading a raid is a zero-effort undertaking and raid leaders should not seek a reward.

I suspect the majority of people who have led ML raids would be closer to my view than yours, but that's just speculation.

2.10 is easy when you have the right classes to do it one of the two easy ways. Even then, there is an element of risk with people rushing in at the last moment, and the more people the greater risk. If it was as easy as you claim, we'd not have had half the struggles we've seen over the last 14 months of people trying to complete it.
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Post by Finolin »

Cryn wrote:2.10 is easy when you have the right classes to do it one of the two easy ways. Even then, there is an element of risk with people rushing in at the last moment, and the more people the greater risk. If it was as easy as you claim, we'd not have had half the struggles we've seen over the last 14 months of people trying to complete it.
Just FYI, 2.10 is easy now. You can get credit (and safely heal) from outside, even in transit via harpies, so ML9 pets and/or focus for the win. No last minute rush (and spike storm) inside required.
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Post by Jarahl »

Cryn wrote:I never made any comment about whether you led raids or not. Leading raids doesn't make you (or me) the be all and end all expert on raid leading. My opinion is that there is some work involved that is deserves recognition. Your opinion, from what I can tell, is that leading a raid is a zero-effort undertaking and raid leaders should not seek a reward.

I suspect the majority of people who have led ML raids would be closer to my view than yours, but that's just speculation.

2.10 is easy when you have the right classes to do it one of the two easy ways. Even then, there is an element of risk with people rushing in at the last moment, and the more people the greater risk. If it was as easy as you claim, we'd not have had half the struggles we've seen over the last 14 months of people trying to complete it.
I've been on 3 ML2 raids the last 2 months and none of em was even close to fuck up with us rushing :)

And I never said the leader shouldnt get anything, he gets credit, respect and the good feeling that he helped his realm, more than enough for me :)
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Post by Lieva »

Finolin wrote:Just FYI, 2.10 is easy now. You can get credit (and safely heal) from outside, even in transit via harpies, so ML9 pets and/or focus for the win. No last minute rush (and spike storm) inside required.
sorry but

:lol:

easy???

only if you have chanter!!!

and a mana ment
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Post by Finolin »

Banana wrote:sorry but

:lol:

easy???

only if you have chanter!!!

and a mana ment
You can replace a pet with a shield hero and just heal safely from outside.

Seriously, easy, especially if you have a zerg, which was how 2.10 was brought up (as being difficult with more people).
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Fiat, 50th Celt Druid ML10 Perfector
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