Manners

[Ankh Morpork]

Situation 3

Figthing mids/albs, killed all in the group except 4-5, still a fg of hibs feel they need to engage the fight...

and on and on and on....

hehe "killed all in teh group except 4-5" tbh I would call that ALL in the group since its 1/2 or less ]/Ankh[/B]

[Moley:)]

Yesterday , my group did see a fight , but we just watched .. we were 3 ppl though ... oh and just cause im so happy , we went PoC and Gwan, Daruinn and me went in to Alb POC and kill 5 albs vs 3 .. aww dots are sooo fun .. 200-300 dmg :cowgif:
Just wish ppl would set up BG's despite your GG's running and have some fun camping bridge or something , its a game we enjoy it together hense mmorpg. :ba:

[Asterixxx]

yes.

/Ankh

cheers for the support hehehe

[Sharkith]

Situation 1

Our group mezzes a full group of albs, we are about to engage the fight and kill them. Suddenly theres a blast and all the albs are free, some ns used GS.

Situation 2

Our group surprise a fg of albs from the side, everyone is perfectly mezzed. Two seconds later we see a chanter run in to the albs gets off one pbae, all albs are free and the chanter insta dies.

I can go on and on and on...

And you guys wonder why people get mad when they get adds and tell them to sod of.

I totally respect you guys and I hope my enjoyment of the game does not in any way impinge on yours. If that means keeping out of your way then cool (I try to anyway). In each of your cited situations the rule would have appeared very clear and so I think it is bad form however can you honestly say it always appears like that? - hope you realise though that the same rule never appears like you just presented nor never as consistently as that. Hence the discussion.

Some good points were made in the thread - but ultimately the reason why it won't be sorted is the vagueness of the rule as it appears in many situations.

If you ever see me around - remember to please add tho I could probably do with the help.



Sharkith

[Briannon]

Situation 1

Our group mezzes a full group of albs, we are about to engage the fight and kill them. Suddenly theres a blast and all the albs are free, some ns used GS.

Situation 2

Our group surprise a fg of albs from the side, everyone is perfectly mezzed. Two seconds later we see a chanter run in to the albs gets off one pbae, all albs are free and the chanter insta dies.

I can go on and on and on...

And you guys wonder why people get mad when they get adds and tell them to sod of.

Yes, I can understand how in these scenarios the actions of the adder can be very frustrating, and I suspect that I've probably done it myself without even realising it. However, what makes this different from a PvE situation is that if everyone gets wiped there is no loss of xp, no con penalty from rezzing or releasing, and still the possibility of earning rps when dead if a dot kills the enemy after you've died. So, all in all, apart from the frustration at tactics being blown by the adder the actual loss is very short-term and of no long-term detriment to the player concerned. Which is why I feel we should try and view the RvR game differently from the PvE game. Sure, get p'd off with jerks adding, pulling, leaching in PvE and arti battles, but not in RvR. And even if p'd off, be polite to the person concerned.

Most people who know me know that I can be quite relaxed about things in game but the one thing that will guarantee a flame coming from me is if I get a pm being rude to me in-game, especially if some tosser is trying to blame me for their own stupidity, but perhaps that's for another thread at another time.

[Briannon]

Can I add some persepctive to the issue about rp's being the be all and end all of RvR activity?

In an earlier post I pointed out that if an evening's RvR results in 3000 rps per session (and that's a good session for my NS!!), then it would take 21 years of playing every night to get to RR12. 30,000 rps per night would take 2 years of playing every night to get RR12.

Bearing that in mind, I would hazard a guess that for the majority of players a nightly return of rps falls between those two figures, so we could be playing for anything between 2 and 21 years to get RR12. I would therefore hazard another guess that for the majority of players RR12 is a completely unachievable objective and their reason for being out in RvR is not about farming realm points.

I may be wrong but I'm guessing that it is a minority of the player base that is going out into RvR and farming gazillions of rps each night to get to the higher RRs, so are we ever going to be able to have a comfortable mix of the two types of players?

I don't know the answer to my own question, but what I do know is that with these kinds of figures, I'll not be doing RvR with the sole aim of farming RPs - I'll be doing it to stuff the assess of the mids and the albs and rob them of their towers, their keeps, their relics, their homes, their lives, their very sanity!!

[Ovi]

Situation 3

Figthing mids/albs, killed all in the group except 4-5, still a fg of hibs feel they need to engage the fight...

and on and on and on....

If you feel that strongly about having fair fights, as I said before, go play a FPS.

The Extra fun that comes from MMORPGs is that you can't guarantee even odds, you never know when the NS will use his GS, maybe you are fighting Albs and a Shadowblade pops his GS?

There are lots of things that can "screw up" your perfect fight, and that is what Makes MMORPGs more fun and more of a long term challenge than FPS (IMHO).

How much better does it feel to wipe the enemy after the NS has spammed his GS, or the chanter breaks mezz with PB?

Given that this is how the game is designed, to be rude to people because they mess up and happen to spoil your perfect fight is not right...even to the GS spamming NS!

Most people on hib/Pryd are at least semi-regular RvRers, probably know who the groups are that don't like adding, and won't add if they get the time to think and assess the situation, but then the less regular players probably don't have the same ability to judge the situation as quick as you do.

[Bidi]

rp is everything otherwise ppl wouldnt add

The whole concept of adding or leeching RP's is silly. Its a moot point, you can do nothing to change it so the sooner people realise this the better. You cannot have a go at somebody for adding full stop.

I remember a thread on FH about a year ago where some leetist(s) decided that Odins (Excal) was the home for fg vs fg and sod the rest, they got verbally abusive towards 2fg's who were having an alliance RVR session that added next to the HMG.

All that happened was that several members of the "leetist" group were reported for abusive behaviour.

It spark a massive debate in the thread and it still rages on today in one form or another.

Its has nothing whatsoever to do with manners or spoiling somebodies fun, this is not currently an 8 vs 8 game and therefore tough luck if you get added on.

My experience on this matter suggests to me that many many RVR guilds are quite happy to stomp on solo's or duo's or group sizes less than thier 8 for quick RP's yet get upset when these same people add on them.

I cant say for certain this applies on this server as I havent been here long, but on Excal I have seen the same leetists add on solo'ers or small groups despite denying it publically.

[Bidi]

Edited for Brevity:

Some, a few, may add to 'leech'. I have not many any of these types of people yet, but there may be some out there. How you recognise a leecher from an innocent person who is simply out for RvR and knows no better I am not sure.

I disagree,

There is no distinction between somebody shooting your target for example and somebody out for fun, they more than likely, are the same thing.

There is no way to recognise them, there are the same.

Situation 3

Figthing mids/albs, killed all in the group except 4-5, still a fg of hibs feel they need to engage the fight...

and on and on and on....

Situation X

Soloing in the frontiers

Get ganked by full group after full group...get added on by Home realm group over again.

Result
Add whenever I want cuz I pay for my subs and I dont recall seeing rules about not adding in RVR.

People that accuse others for adding need the wake up call, not those they abuse or try to make up an imaginary set rules to quote from.

As for manners in game, we create chars on a server based game to rip apart other chars and in some cases incinerate them whenever we get a chance...

Manners would be challenging somebody to a duel outside by slaping them in a face and dueling them on equal terms outside....

Maybe I'm just old and cynical. But its a no win argument.

Guildwars would be a much better game for the FG vs FG fanatics. eg: the game is designed for it.

[Luon]

sorry if it sound elitist comming form solo shade but its true ppl wouldnt add and get silleh over it if it wasent for the rps. ppl can say what they want that they prefer 8 vs 8 to measure epeen or whatever bottom line is still you dont target an enemy realm dood if not to get the reward of some rps.
Most ppl that rvr more so called ELite ppl have more manners in rvr then ppl who rvr less so called rpg ppl. i dont know how many times for example maelmstorm have spared my char instead of steamrolling just because.


If winning is winning using all means that means ppl should start use radar speed haxx evenmore.

And manners fgs. is it manners to single out a small grp of ppl and calling them elitist is it manners to say i add cause this is a realm vs realm game . i dunno all care about is that i pay my subs and play cause i like it. And Hibernia manners never been that good towards eachother ppl who say that have obivisoly not been playing on this server so long there is always conflicts and bad behaviour and silleh ppl been like that since server open in beta. If now for some reason witch i think ppl dont agree with me ask tenpit to reopen old pryd.net forum and go check all threads to see how much manners hibernia really have had.....