ToA > Wow pve

[Ovi]

Nik,

Not sure where you get the idea that DAoC is much moe casual friendly than WoW, in DAoC I always felt that I would never be able to compete (PVP wise) because I didn't spend enough time PvPing.

In wow I can spend an hour or 2 doing something and still feel that I have progressed. Obviously the end-game instances need more commitment, but I don't feel I *need* to do them to compete, unlike MLs in DAoC (at least on certain classes).

[Nikolas]

In daoc you can make progress in pve or pvp at your own pace. In wow you can make progress up to a fixed point. This fixed point will be determined on how long you can spend doing pvp, ie no further progression, and pve as far as your guild is capable of going.

For me this makes daoc a more casual game.. you can do it in your own time.

[Ovi]

For me this makes daoc a more casual game.. you can do it in your own time.

I don't agree with that. In wow PvP there is a highest point, once other reach that they can't get further away from you. The longer DAoC goes on the further behind others you get.

PvE the ony difference is that DAoC large raids tend not to be guild only affairs, afaik there is no reason it has to be that way.

[Satyn]

I dont agree with that point either tbh. I havent played WoW so have no idea how it goes there. But if you're a casual player in daoc and you play two hours a day, you can forget about ML's, Co5 etc.

[Lieva]

as a friend said
it will be interesting to see the backstories to Warhammer
as appt there are lots of info regarding the humans elves and dwarfs but not so much rgarding the other races in the game

never played it so not sure whats in it but means they would need to create a story for the 'bad' guys from scratch

[Cernos]

In daoc you can make progress in pve or pvp at your own pace. In wow you can make progress up to a fixed point. This fixed point will be determined on how long you can spend doing pvp, ie no further progression, and pve as far as your guild is capable of going.

For me this makes daoc a more casual game.. you can do it in your own time.

Yep this is enormous in the long run and something which Blizzard seem to have overlooked or are arrogant enough about the success of their product / brand not to care. Their philosophy seems to be that there'll always be new players coming to the game, so it doesn't matter if people leave. They might be in for a shock in the long term, but they've made so much money I doubt they're bothered.

In Daoc you can leave for 6 months, a year or even more and come back and find your characters are just as they were (barring any database accidents). The game will have moved on but your gear is likely to still be viable (a 16.5 dps weapon will always be a 16.5 dps weapon), you will still have all your realm points and abilities, you might even have a free respec due to game changes. Sure there's things you'll want to do to adapt to game changes, some new items you might want to acquire, but largely you can jump straight back into the action (if there is any, my problem when I returned recently was that I couldn't play peak times and outside of this there wasn't any action due to low pop).

In WoW, leave for as little as a month and your PvP rank takes a huge tumble and your raiding guild will have dropped you from their raid system (because endgame epic raids need military planning). Leave for 3+ months and your PvP rank will be back to zero and your raiding guild probably kicked you out altogether (and won't want you back because after only a short time your gear will be substandard and they're all running around in their shiny new raid gear and quite understandably don't want to waste even more time getting you back up to speed).

All those months of effort (and it is effort because of how the endgame is such a grind) gone to waste. You just poured a nice chunk of your life down the Blizzard drain. Sure you keep any PvP and PvE gear rewards you may have earned, but due to the power inflation of ever more insanely powereful items being introduced into the PvE endgame raids, your current items will be rapidly outmoded.

This is the #1 reason I will probably never re-open my WoW account. I had a lot of fun, no regrets. When it stopped being fun I left. But to return would be too demoralising to see everything I worked for either reset to zero or devalued to the point of worthlessness due to gear arms race. The devs are creating a massive balance crisis with all the ever more uber gear they keep adding. At least Daoc realised the error of this approach to game balance and pulled back from it after ToA (they just introduced new imbalanced classes instead - must be due for a few more in the next expansion

[Xest]

PVE 1-59 in WoW is far more fun than 1-49 in Daoc.

I found WoW infinetely more boring tbh. WoW's quests were equally as dry and dull as DAoCs (more so if you include ToA MLs/Encounters which were more fun than WoW quests), grinding was much slower (lvl17 on my druid in WoW was as slow as lvl35 - 40 in DAoC). Perhaps it's cos I rolled a druid, apparently some WoW classes are faster but either way WoW wasn't the magical PvE wonder some made it out to be, it certainly did nothing better than DAoC did.

Still, UO's skill progression system was and still is the best of any MMOG and until MMOGs move towards that system and away from the silly levelling system of now (to be fair Planetside did but that wasn't a proper MMOG) then levelling in MMOGs will be as dull and dry as it's always been bar UO.

[Cernos]

Perhaps it's cos I rolled a druid, apparently some WoW classes are faster but either way WoW wasn't the magical PvE wonder some made it out to be, it certainly did nothing better than DAoC did.

There's your problem right there. Druid is perhaps the slowest levelling of all the WoW classes. All WoW classes solo quite well but the rates do vary enormously. Fastest is probably Hunter or Rogue and slowest is easily the Druid.

Also, because of race restrictions Druids don't have the best start zones, especially where interesting quests are concerned. For Alliance, Night Elf start zone is isolated and the quests are rather dull, I agree. Tauren start zone is a bit better, but still the worst of the Horde start zones. Try Undead, Orc, Troll, Gnome or Dwarf start zones, far more fun - some genuinely fun quests to be had.

Quests in Wow are quite enjoyable and well thought out on the whole, though there are some rubbish ones like farm the same mob type until some rare item drops. The quests also get more adventurous as you level up and some chains are genuinely exciting. At level 17, many of the best quests are still ahead of you.

The quest interace in WoW, whilst plenty of room for improvement, is one of the better one in a MMORPG. EVE has a good mission interface too. The Daoc quest interface by comparison is clunky, non intuitive and overly verbose (a backstory is important, but not when it turns into a dull and stilted novel).

[Oceaa]

I dont agree with that point either tbh. I havent played WoW so have no idea how it goes there. But if you're a casual player in daoc and you play two hours a day, you can forget about ML's, Co5 etc.

Not true.

ML's take 1-2 hours each to do.

Co5 takes 2-3 hours.

Not that hard

[Lieva]

Daoc is becomming more casual player friendly and noob friendly tbh. Which is how it should have been from the begining...

Co5 Does sux however but i do like how you can get the stuff for it without doing the quests so even that is based casual playerwise.

Would be nice if you could get toa stuff like that also.
MLs without the master quests