i think peeps get wound up when anyone claims an arti/item just to sell it.
You may need the money to finish your ranger template but peeps need the cloak to finish their template so by claiming just to sell they feel worse than they would have done if they had just lost the item by a roll. Also most people at the last stages of getting the last piece to the template would also be poor so participating in an auction would be the last thing they could do.
You havent done anything wrong but in the past people have suddenly told people they have claimed items and took an item just to sell it so i would assume this could be just past betrayals which is making people feel worse than they should in this instance.
Pricing/claiming discussion
If a raid leader runs a raid and a) wants to claim things and b) states up front that (s)he will be claiming things then they have a right to do so. So long at it is stated up front.
If someone 'needs' and item and is close to finishing their template and they attend a raid where a raid leader claims the item they need they have to accept that this possibility was one of the conditions of the raid and therefore they cannot complain.
In the case where the raid leader then goes and sells or auctions the claimed item and the person who claims that they 'needed' it feels let down. That person 'needs' to think about their expectations and whether or not those were reasonable. They might feel aggreived that their expectations have been dissappointed, but those expectations were their expectations and as such are not really the responsibility of the raid leader.
You might argue that raid leaders have some resonsibility to manage persons expectations in this respect. There is no doubt that this can make things run more smoothly on the raid when everyone knows what they have to do to help the get finished successfully. I would however be very skeptical that any raid leader could manage all expectations and so sometimes people will be dissappointed no matter what.
In this case some people have had an expectation that a claimed item would not be sold. Yet the raid rules did not state what would happen to any claimed item. Should Plac have prepared for those that would feel like this? I am not so sure. Are they 'right' to feel aggrieved. I am not so sure. They do have a right however to say they are pissed off. It is of course Plac's decision if he wants to adjust his rules. It is equally the aggrieved persons decision to either turn up or avoid his future raids.
Personally I do not give a stuff what he did with any of these items I am just so pleased to have a person who can tolerate these raids if he is rewarded for that effort so be it.
If I had wanted one of the items he claimed would I be dissappointed? Of course. Would I say so here? No. Would I turn up to future raids? Dammed right I would.
regards
Sharkith
If someone 'needs' and item and is close to finishing their template and they attend a raid where a raid leader claims the item they need they have to accept that this possibility was one of the conditions of the raid and therefore they cannot complain.
In the case where the raid leader then goes and sells or auctions the claimed item and the person who claims that they 'needed' it feels let down. That person 'needs' to think about their expectations and whether or not those were reasonable. They might feel aggreived that their expectations have been dissappointed, but those expectations were their expectations and as such are not really the responsibility of the raid leader.
You might argue that raid leaders have some resonsibility to manage persons expectations in this respect. There is no doubt that this can make things run more smoothly on the raid when everyone knows what they have to do to help the get finished successfully. I would however be very skeptical that any raid leader could manage all expectations and so sometimes people will be dissappointed no matter what.
In this case some people have had an expectation that a claimed item would not be sold. Yet the raid rules did not state what would happen to any claimed item. Should Plac have prepared for those that would feel like this? I am not so sure. Are they 'right' to feel aggrieved. I am not so sure. They do have a right however to say they are pissed off. It is of course Plac's decision if he wants to adjust his rules. It is equally the aggrieved persons decision to either turn up or avoid his future raids.
Personally I do not give a stuff what he did with any of these items I am just so pleased to have a person who can tolerate these raids if he is rewarded for that effort so be it.
If I had wanted one of the items he claimed would I be dissappointed? Of course. Would I say so here? No. Would I turn up to future raids? Dammed right I would.
regards
Sharkith
Na Fianna Dragun
Karak-Eight Peaks, Kiera ze Witch Hunter
Eve online - Kaminjosvig.
Karak-Eight Peaks, Kiera ze Witch Hunter
Eve online - Kaminjosvig.
-
Alexandrinus
- Emerald Rider
- Posts: 1523
- Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2005 9:44 am
- Location: Austria
A right to claim the item to use, not to sell. Raid leaders who do that will tend to find that their raids will have a lack of attendees after a while.Alexandrinus wrote:raid leader has any right, if you dont think so try to lead your own raid and you will see he really deserves it
Need before greed, that's always been what people claim the 'system' is on Hib/Prydwen.
Usp Caffeinechanter - level 6 Roasted Bean
Can find me as Manachanter in most things...
World of Warships [NA] mainly
Can find me as Manachanter in most things...
World of Warships [NA] mainly
Can't say it better tbfhVidX wrote:A right to claim the item to use, not to sell. Raid leaders who do that will tend to find that their raids will have a lack of attendees after a while.
Need before greed, that's always been what people claim the 'system' is on Hib/Prydwen.
Gahn LoneWolf Celt Seraph Tiarna Prydwen
Na Fianna Dragun
Gahn Lonewolf Guardian [TDA] on Gunnar's Hold
Na Fianna Dragun
Gahn Lonewolf Guardian [TDA] on Gunnar's Hold
Thx guys, i go to a lot of raid before do mine's, in that raid i never stay for lotto, and , like lot's of u know,i don't like lotto stuff, sometimes i give stuff to other persone and he lotto while i log off or do other thing.
But when i spent 3h+ leading a Raid, i'm tired, i want to finish it.
I think, that i need something for do it, like a good drop, as you know, and like i said before, rules were posted in forum, u read post and come to Raid, so why u come? u w8ing to finish raid, see what item i claim, w8 that i want to sell it and whine about it?...
I'm not blaming Amedor, i know starting price was a bit high, but see, now it's at 55p.
Just saying, that if u don't like RL claim an item:
1-Don't go to a that Raid
2-Make your own raid.
P.S: i w8 u at ml6 and ml8 of this weekend
But when i spent 3h+ leading a Raid, i'm tired, i want to finish it.
I think, that i need something for do it, like a good drop, as you know, and like i said before, rules were posted in forum, u read post and come to Raid, so why u come? u w8ing to finish raid, see what item i claim, w8 that i want to sell it and whine about it?...
I'm not blaming Amedor, i know starting price was a bit high, but see, now it's at 55p.
Just saying, that if u don't like RL claim an item:
1-Don't go to a that Raid
2-Make your own raid.
P.S: i w8 u at ml6 and ml8 of this weekend
Alb - INACTIVE
Placador Merc lvl 51 ML10
Caby Cabalist lvl 51 ML10
Mid - ACTIVE!!!
Hib - INACTIVE
Elwarden Warden lvl 50 ML10
Setaman Animist lvl 50 ML8
Placz Ranger lvl 48 ML0 ( Soon ML10, 3rd ML RUSH INC)
Placador Merc lvl 51 ML10
Caby Cabalist lvl 51 ML10
Mid - ACTIVE!!!
Hib - INACTIVE
Elwarden Warden lvl 50 ML10
Setaman Animist lvl 50 ML8
Placz Ranger lvl 48 ML0 ( Soon ML10, 3rd ML RUSH INC)
Vidx,VidX wrote:A right to claim the item to use, not to sell. Raid leaders who do that will tend to find that their raids will have a lack of attendees after a while.
Need before greed, that's always been what people claim the 'system' is on Hib/Prydwen.
in the absence of any real way to judge who 'needs' what, you are asking for trouble IMHO. There can be no 'real' way of assessing need and it is all so dependent on personal views that for me personally it represents another form of tyranny. The people who shout the most and complain the loudest get what they want and what is worse some of them start shouting things like piss off back to Excal which for me is way out of line.
The intent of need before greed might be honourable - but how the hell is anyone to judge? It can end up being another stick to beat the already tired raid leaders with.
Sharkith
does anyone remember venoids raids? he lead a lot of them and only ever claimed the remains on the first run of a ml for himself after that everything was rolled on.
And he beleived in need b4 greed too, making fake items to put on macro's for /bg and if anyone rolled then would be banned from rolling. Worked a charm as ppl looked at stats and actually rolled on what they needed rather than just pressing /random 100 0.0000001 seconds after the items has been spammed in bg.
Not saying he's better or worse than any other raid leader just pointing out at least 1 raid leader alot of ppl had respec for and never once claimed an item for cash ect.
(as a side note i don't agree with claiming anything but if the raid leader puts it down as a rule then not much an be done about that if u attend)
And he beleived in need b4 greed too, making fake items to put on macro's for /bg and if anyone rolled then would be banned from rolling. Worked a charm as ppl looked at stats and actually rolled on what they needed rather than just pressing /random 100 0.0000001 seconds after the items has been spammed in bg.
Not saying he's better or worse than any other raid leader just pointing out at least 1 raid leader alot of ppl had respec for and never once claimed an item for cash ect.
(as a side note i don't agree with claiming anything but if the raid leader puts it down as a rule then not much an be done about that if u attend)