Genedril wrote:
For the record, proper socialism has never been attempted. It's always been driven by the middle classes trying to attain power over those with power (in the cases of Communisim as people generally understand it). Marx said this would never work & the workers had to understand & appreciate their situation in order to force social change to move away from capitalism (which he viewed as slavery - business owners 'owning' the workers).
So what is proper socialism ? Really, it can't work unless you apply enough freedom that you are back to a free market.
For example, if you split the country so that it is made up of lots of independent communes so that there is not oppression from the central government, they will naturally compete with each other and that will push some back to market economics. This then requires a central government to prevent it happening and you are back where you started.
If you want a smile then some people think the US has exported more socialism than any 'communist' country - in the form of Star Trek (after the original series) ias it's effectively a socialist society where everyone performs to the best of their ability in a role that suits them without the need for cash. The capitalists are portrayed as being twisted money grabbers out for themselves.
Pretty much. At the end of DS9, they basically killed off the Ferengi as a capitalistic society. However, alot of artists tend to fall more on the socialism side for some reason. Artists tend to be more on the side of emotion than reason, and socialism focuses on emotions rather than reason and reality. In ST, they never really covered the point that being honest can also be profitable. If Quark waters down the drinks, they he will have fewer return customers. Alot of buisnesses in the real world depend on their reputation.
However, the other arguement is that it is a future society that was to have certain characteristics. Since the writers aren't from the future, they didn't know how to get it to work. In ST, all material needs are covered with ubiquitous replicator technology. Maybe the federation is what happens when most of the population only works in jobs that they enjoy and then only for as hard as they want. All unpopular jobs are just seamlessly automated. Would you work if you had a salary from investments to match the modern day US (or just that you could have any material thing you want) ? Such a society might tend towards competition for other people's attention/notice since they will always be in shortage. Focus in life would be impressing others and "office" politics. The currency becomes reputation and not money. This is even kinda what happens in ST, it is all about who you know (power is being able to call the other person's superior officer). Even with replicators, there is still issues for things that are not material, like science research and designing the "patterns" for the replicators (or maybe just the GUI for open repliCAD v 9.3
).
There are federation credits in ST, but they seem to be a non-convertible currency.
As for animal testing - I'd say it's a neccesary evil for medical research (I have a hard time squaring it mentally for cosmetic research - however that's a judgement call). I'd far rather that some animals were sacrificed in order to cure humans than just to let the humans die. On the down side I think that the human race is over-populating the planet so I'm kind of stuck on the fence.
But not western countries .. hmm I should add that to my sig
. Alot are heading to negative growth rates. Also, every time someone dies, all their knowledge gained over a lifetime is lost.
The 'testing' should not be done on age related diseases in my eyes, prolonging life to the point where it starts to have (what I'd consider to be) little quality is a waste of resources (both in the scientific research & also in the additional resources required to deal with the older population). Hmm, sounds a bit Logan's Run-esque.
The problem is that most age research focuses on curing specific diseases. However, they are all caused by aging. Eventually (but might be harder than people think), aging will be slowed, stopped and reversed. Hopefully this is not accomplished by genetic enginnering that needs to be applied before birth though
. Also, people who don't commit suicide are valuing life over death, they should be allowed avail of medical research if they want (and can pay for it).
I wanted to say something about morality but I've harped on long enough. Are humans born with it? I'd think that society instills/dictates it's own morals on the young & these are what we grow up with & pass on. Morals have changed over the centuries & morals differ from culture to culture.
I think it is a mix, we have basic morals built in (due to evolution) and these can be switched on/off by social pressures. If the tribe was theatened you need to drop the prohibition on murder pretty quickly. Look at nazi Germany, alot of the same Germans if born 20 years later would not have supported Hitler at all.
